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Thread: The basics of soldering.

  1. #31

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    <blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by virus692

    Just a quick shime in <font color="red">DO NOT USE A COLD HEAT GUN</font id="red"> I fried a hasbro sound board that way... <font color="purple">DARN LAWS OF PHYSICS</font id="purple">.[][}]
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    That, and they take forever to heat up, and when they do, it's not hot enough.

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  2. #32
    Sith Lord Do-Clo's Avatar
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    <blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by james3

    I just found it is easier to use force lightning to solder every thing. Give that a try[][]

    Really though, I love that this is getting done. I have a 45 watter with a brand spanking new tip and that makes all the difference. There is a fine line between having the tip tinned and a cloopy tip that won't give good heat.

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    The last time I used force lightning I ended up destroying the entire building, but then I have an anger management problem. [}]

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  3. #33

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    Also when you solder the LED don't melt the little plasic bubble the LED sits in. I scorched mine a little the first time I did that.

  4. #34
    Council Member Novastar's Avatar
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    Yes, Arlaman... that would be.... bad.

    I think Do-Clo makes some really great points regarding soldering--and he ought to know. I do remember him saying something about knowing what it means to hold things to military standard...

    Some other soldering tips I didn't see here:

    * TEST YOUR SOLDER JOINT BY PULLING ON IT

    Most people are... like... "afraid" to pull on a wire once they have it connected. I think they are afraid it is going to break. Hmm. DUH. There is barely a hidden message here... You are building a piece of electronics... that is going to get the bloody 'ELL kicked out of it... for heaven's sake... TEST the solder joint BEFORE you decide to put it all together only to find that the solder was waiting for a stiff breeze to make it fall off. Bad.

    * MORE SOLDER IS GOOD, RIGHT?

    Wrong. The *correct* amount is good. What that is... actually differs with the connection. And the gauge of wire. Use your brain, and experience. You do not need a giant glob for a wire... but you want a "pool" when doing the LED anode & cathode on the little star base plate. And yes, as Do-Clo says--avoid sharp edges. I hate it when my solder pools have horns. Evil solder joints!!!

    * I NEED TO SOLDER WIRES TOGETHER THE SAME WAY, EVERY TIME, RIGHT?

    Not necessarily. Sometimes, you might solder together wires when they are "side by side". Or maybe you'll do the natural thing and solder them to sort of "re-build" into looking like "one" wire. It doesn't matter as long as the connection is strong.

    * WHAT GAUGE OF WIRE SHOULD I USE?

    Well, you really don't want to go TOO thin, and you certainly don't want some freakin' piece of licorice in there...! Remember that most of the time... you don't have tons of room in your hilt! You're wiring things up to fit inside a tube!! Expect to get creative... you don't have the luxury of a 5' x 5' space to wire "as you please".

    My suggestion is 22 or 24 gauge.

    * DO I NEED TO THREAD MY WIRE THROUGH THE LITTLE HOLES IN PARTS LIKE SWITCHES?

    Not necessarily. This all depends on your "failsafe" style of thinking. If you want some layers of prevention so that wires are much less likely to come apart:

    1. If there ARE holes for a device like a switch or a port or whatever... sure, go ahead and use them if you like! You do not NEED to if you solder job is strong, but... as we said: failsafes!

    2. For wire to wire connections, after stripping the wires, twist the stranded leads together to form a braid. Unfortunately, you can't really "tin" the wires first if you choose to go this way. But then, you can "draw" the solder right into the wires together! You have to be fairly "artistic" and creative with this method to make it solid soldering-wise... but it CAN work.

    3. Use the method I mentioned further above, where you sort of lay the wires next to one another, side by side, parallel to one another (think like railroad tracks), and apply the twisting method above, or just tin and solder if you like.

    4. Once you're complete with your solering, find places all about your wiring configuration to tape down "stress points". That is--where you think wires could get yanked and bent in a bad way... see if you can take the stress AWAY from the joint, and place it on a "real" part of the wire!


    Remember, those last few numbered suggestions... aren't really great "technique" for large projects... but sometimes they will be perfect for sabers since you have so little room to work with... and they go through a giant amount of shock and stress.

    FINALLY... isolate EVERYTHING. Never never never ever leave wiring metal/solder exposed. Even if you think it is miles away from ever touching another lead... all it takes is ONE mistake, and you might cross + with -. Very bad.

    So... save yourself a headache, remember what the Ghostbusters said:

    "DON'T CROSS THE STREAMS!"

    ~~ GREYTALE NOVASTAR (Writer, Director, Choreographer, Sound Designer, Actor, Saber Designer, Vocal Artist)
    ~~ Balance of Power, EP I: "Into The Lion's Den"
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    ~~ The Crystal Focus Sound CD Compendiums... are HERE! ~~
    ~~ Nova & Caine's Staged Combat System... comin' SOON!
    ~~ Crystal Focus Wiring Guide

  5. #35
    Aryk Ky'Ratsu
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    Default Braided wire after "fanning" it out

    Thanks Novastar for the added info. You've got great timing. I was just reviewing the tutorial again since I'm ready to start soldering for the first time after months of delays b/c of work.

    I can't remember now who suggested it (it's not in this string), but I'm also going to put a bit of hot glue on all the wire-to-part joints for that extra "failsafe". Better to pull on the glue instead of the joint itself.

  6. #36
    Council Member Novastar's Avatar
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    I would highly recommend avoiding hot glue altogether, unless you are NOT covering where a solder point goes down to its corresponding connect on the board.

    Why?

    If the solder point DOES fail (which it can and will given time and just the nature of hand-soldering), the glue will create a GIANT mess that I will never fully tell you about.

    For something like wire to wire--it's not THAT big of a deal since you can simply clip it and start anew. If you get glue on a joint in a BOARD... well, good luck with the cleaning process. It's not fun.

    Finally, I noticed that most hot glues just sort of peel off with ease anyhow. I have yet to find a glue that really does its job for whatever purpose come to think of it.
    ~~ GREYTALE NOVASTAR (Writer, Director, Choreographer, Sound Designer, Actor, Saber Designer, Vocal Artist)
    ~~ Balance of Power, EP I: "Into The Lion's Den"
    ~~ Balance of Power, EP II: "Ashes of The Phoenix"
    ~~ The Crystal Focus Sound CD Compendiums... are HERE! ~~
    ~~ Nova & Caine's Staged Combat System... comin' SOON!
    ~~ Crystal Focus Wiring Guide

  7. #37

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    I have to agree with Novastar, and add that our application will cause solder joints to fail at some point: we're fighting with the saber, causing impacts and vibration to the whole saber. The solder points might crack or become loose at some point, causing intermitent contact or fail completely. If the maintenance is easier, you're gaining in head ache and time.

    I have one of my saber that I have to unmount to find out what solder point or connector makes that the saber shuts off upon impact. I think I'll use the opportunity to make a huge overhaul and convert to K2 or luxIII plus sound instead of my current Lux1 setup.

    All to say, think maintenance when building your saber.
    -Mars

    Embrace the luxeon side of the Force... to bring light, into lightsabers

  8. #38
    Aryk Ky'Ratsu
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    Default Soldering iron tip won't tin

    OK, I'll ditch the hot glue idea. Thanks for the heads up.

    Today I finally sat down to practice soldering for the first time. I'm using some scrap PCB from a piece of equipment to practice on. I'm using a 30W iron from Wal-Mart. It might not be the best choice, but some had said to use 15-25W for board work, others said 30-45, so I thought 30 was a good compromise to try out since I'm new.

    The instructions said to let the iron warm up for 3 minutes (the "silver" metal of the tip and iron shaft started turning gold/brown in that time), then to tin the tip. I tried that, and like Shaas said happened to him in the LED wiring topic, the solder just beaded up into a ball and fell off the tip and wouldn't stick. As I kept trying to tin it, the tip just kept getting darker (oxidized?). The 1/4" point is now just brown/gray, and the 3/4" tip shaft and thin tip base is sort of dull to shiny metallic blue. The iron's shaft below that is still gold/brown. I kept trying long enough that you couldn't say it hadn't heated up yet.

    So does this mean that the 30W can't get hot enough since the solder isn't "flowing" onto the tip? If it should be fine, what am I doing wrong? When I Googled basic soldering tips, one site recommended this solder paste/flux that both cleans and tins the tip at the same time. Has anyone used that before?

  9. #39
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    No, what you did is fine. If your iron is the 30W Lenk I've seen it does fine (I used to use one before I managed to pull the wires out in a tripping incident). The problem is that tinning doesn't occur immeadiately. It takes some use to become really well tinned.

    I normally don't worry about having the tip tinned when I have a new tip. It heats up all over so flowing isn't the issue. At the end of my soldering job I set out to get it tinned. It's hard to fully describe as it's a doing type thing, but I just use a wet sponge and solder smoothing it over the tip.

    The tinning goo is okay. I don't really use it but it's not a waste of your money. I think everyone should own flux though. It saves me from frustration when the iron and solder decides to not play nice. Especially those situation where you are poking something through a PCB.
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  10. #40
    Aryk Ky'Ratsu
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    Thanks xwing.

    No, my 30W brand is Electro-Tek...that was the only model they had other than a gun (which folks recommended against here).

    After my last post, I used a little Bar Keeper's Friend (oxalic acid powder) to clean the oxidation off the tip, then tried the tinning again. This time I got a small glob on top and it didn't roll off. So I let it sit there a bit as an experiment. When I wiped it away with the sponge, I had a nice patch of tin on the tip that was sticking...SUCCESS!! Partially at least. Couldn't get it to work a 2nd time...or 3rd...or 4th... Will try again today. Is that what you meant about the sponge? You have a small glob on the tip and wipe it onto the sponge which still leaves a layer behind? This is hard to explain. Firebird's tutorial is good basic info, but it would be nice if one of the Masters on this site could do a YouTube on soldering for sabers (e.g., the LED, basic wires, etc.). Then you could direct the soldering virgins there to really see how it's done.

    You had said you don't really need to have it tinned at first b/c you'll get good heat transfer. I did try some soldering even without it tinned, but several of test joints were grainy and/or dull gray w/c folks here and other sites I googled said was a sign of a bad joint, oxidation from the tip is causing it b/c not tinned, joint is supposed to be shiny for good electrical contact, etc.

    Soldering sounds easy enough when you read about it. Ain't that always the case? I see why everyone says you need to practice. I just have to get this down pat on the scrap before I try on the real parts. Don't want to fry my LED...or even worse...burn my buttered toast!

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