Supplemental tip LED?

**wackogracko** · 08-16-2009, 02:54 AM

Really sorry if this has already been discussed somewhere else, please let me know if it has. Also, this is my first post, I just joined the custom saber scene and don't own a saber yet, so I'm definitely not aware of all the in and outs yet, just going off what I read.

I've been noticing that "dim" spots along the blades length seem to be a reoccurring problem. A lot of this has been resolved with optics (lenses) at the base of the saber, but a small dim spot seems to persist (correct me if I'm wrong) even with this improvement.

Now FX sabers corrected this issue by using a string/bar of LEDs, but those tend to break after repeated duels, stage fighting, etc.

This got me to thinking about using a single supplemental LED in the tip of the blade instead of just a flat mirrror/reflective disc of mylar. Since the LED would only be supplemental (adding a bit of additional light to the dim spot on the blade), it could be pretty weak and thus small, low power, and low heat.

The hurdles to overcome i foresee are:
-Getting power to the top, although if its a single LED, it should just be two, maybe 3 wires (not up to speed on the electronics end of everything yet).

-Mounting it in the tip so that it withstands the pounding of repeated light saber duels. I was thinking fill the entire tip (with LED in correct position) with clear epoxy or silicon. Yes it would be very permanent but if you get it right it should allow it to take a severe beating and still function properly.

-Focusing the supplemental light onto the dim area. This would have to be done with some sort of lens I presume, and would have to be fiddled with to find the best configuration. Theoretically, the lenses could be pretty small and be glued directly onto the LED housing (im talking small, standard, .5W LED or something).

-Matching the color could be tricky, but since its only supplemental light, it would probably mix pretty well with the other light if you got close with the color and you (theoretically) wouldn't really be able to tell.

Anyways, just a random idea I had that I wanted to throw out there. Sorry again if its already been discussed or isn't really feasible (or if dim spots just really aren't a problem anymore for whatever reason).

**dgdve** · 08-20-2009, 07:10 AM

Welcome and enjoy... well heres how i see it... long story short the tips of blades do tend to come off after some serious dueling i havent lost one yet but a few guys lose them all the time so "led tips" wont really work.. and thing is i think your perspective is more from photo's, the camera can pic up things your eye cannot there will always be a small amount of flare at the base but generally the diffuser evens it out.. if your led is to weak or your blade is to long then you get dim sections but even then its not as noticable in real life. To gain durability as well as displayability(you never saw a lightsaber with an attached blade on film O.O) you must give up some things
~dave

**Lord Maul** · 08-20-2009, 08:17 AM

What you are proposing throws in so many challenges. The wires running up the blade would rattle around, and the would be noticeable from the outside as a long dark line in the blade. Also, how do you remove the blade if there are electronics in it? How do you get the wires past the main LED and optics?

Long story short, it won't really work. Putting a reflective disk in the blade tip, along with a well diffused blade will work wonders.

**beggarsoutpost** · 08-20-2009, 09:08 AM

You could use a 10 degree lens instead of a 5... The only time I've had a blade that was not lit up solid from the bottom to the top is when I used a 5 degree lens... After I switched to the 10 my blades hold the light evenly from top to bottom with no visible dimming at all......

**Novastar** · 08-22-2009, 05:26 PM

I suppose in THEORY, one could:

* Run ~exposed~, HAIRLINE-thin, silver wires up the blade. Reasoning for hairline wiring would be... well... you'd be far less apt to "see" the wires, and the reflective exposed wires would reflect light.
* Solder those wires to a supplemental LED in the tip--such as a Lux I?
* Provide minimal current to it... just enough to illuminate a decent amount
* See if it makes much of a difference overall

However... disadvantages:

* Exposed wires?!??!?! What the HECK is Novastar suggesting?!? Has he LOST HIS M*I*N*D*?!??

* HAIRLINE THIN??!?!?! See sentence above above!!
* If the tip flies off... your extra LED is goin' bye-bye
* Shock of blade impact alone would not be pretty for the system overall... especially with "hairline thin" wires
* Extra work that could render the blade "less removeable"
* Affixing the wires under or over the diffusion solution... would drive you bloody BONKERS
* Good luck if it even makes the slightest difference... lighting properties/behavior & science would probably say... uh... this extra + low-powered LED probably wouldn't make a difference
* Why not just get a more powerful LED in the hilt and be done with it
* Why not shorten the blade slightly
* Why not improve the diffusion (especially at the dim spot maybe?)
* Why not improve the mirror solution @ the tip

This idea runs into the same "fatal flaws" that I did when I was thinking of better ways to have a tip made or better ways to affix it. Just not worth the effort for something so minor.

But hey... you could EXPERIMENT with it--nothing wrong with THAT!

**wackogracko** · 08-28-2009, 12:44 AM

Thanks for all the replies. Like I said, I haven't built a saber before, and I just wanted to get the idea out there since it was rolling around in my head.

So my other thought was to put a slight curvature in the mirror in the tip (slight dome shape), thus causing a little bit more directed reflection to the dim spot on the blade.
You could do this by having the mirror disc thin and flexible, and then just putting a peg or something behind it that pushes the center part up. You could easily adjust the curvature of the dome by shortening or lengthening the peg, thus allowing you to "focus in" the reflecting point of the light. Think it would help or make any sort of difference or has anyone tried it? Again, definitly not a seasoned pro, but I do like conjuring up new solutions to old problems (as im sure most everyone else on this forum does).

I hope all that peg stuff made sense, let me know if you are confused.

**TroyO** · 08-28-2009, 07:46 AM

Hmmm... what about a 3.7v button cell and LED in the tip?

**Sairon** · 08-28-2009, 12:18 PM

Then you got a dim section where the batteries are... Bottom line, use a good difffuser and a reflective tip.

**Novastar** · 08-28-2009, 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by TroyO

Hmmm... what about a 3.7v button cell and LED in the tip?

I don't agree with Sairon here... Troyo--I think that's a pretty good idea... at least for testing.

Not to mention turning it on and off would sort of suck... but... aside from that!! Seriously... not too bad an idea.

It's possible though that (sadly)... you might run into the whole "light theory" thing again though:

* High-power LED Light source X is "100" brightness (100 lumens, or whatever your gauge)
* Little coin-cell powered tiny LED light source Y is... "25"(??) brightness
* Even though source Y is far away from source X... hmm... will that light be seen? I don't know

Troyo's idea would be most effective for:

* LONG blades. Long meaning 38" or more? Maybe even 36"??
* "darker" colors... such as purple (via RGB... or RB, whatever)... or even deep royal blues
* Corbin-style diffusion film
* Thinner blades... such as 3/4"

But hey... I dunno... like I said--it's worth a SHOT!!

Oh... and for anyone saying the tip would just break off... well... sure, it might. But big deal, you'd lose like $4? $2?? I don't know.