Relationship (Blade evenness versus color?)

[Eandori]

Quick question I wanted to bounce off you guys. After looking at TONS of pictures of people's LED sabers, I seem to notice that there are some very evenly lit blue and green LED sabers but red sabers seem to always have a large amount of flair at the hilt.

Has anybody else noticed this?

I have a green Lux K2 saber which is very even, nearly zero flair at the hilt. I have never yet personally built a red, white orange or blue Luxeon saber, but then again I have never seen a picture of red with an equally low amount of hilt-flair.

Is that just how the pictures come out? Do some red sabers appear in RL to be very even, but picture show flair?

Examples, Here is Erv's custom sabers (green and blue)



Here is my saber next to a master replica (Green K2 with only 1 amp)


Here's a picture from Killphil's thread, with a very evenly lit red saber blade.

[xwingband]

pictures lie and sometimes they don't...

If you want to split hairs here's another of Erv's pics and isn't as even:


Red and Red/O are bright and the camera sees it differently. I would say of all colors the Red is most likely to show that huge flair in pictures.

[Eandori]

Yeah, that picture of Erv's with a red LED is about the most Even I have seen.

So you believe the difference in flair between red and other colors is mainly due to the camera sensitivity? That's not what it looks like in person? I'm really hoping when I get around to building a red Luxeon saber that I can get the blade as even as my green.

[Novastar]

Hi Edwin... I'll be shipping those test materials to you today... sorry I wasn't able to yesterday.

Let's see... on some thread before, I mentioned almost all of the insane variables that come into play (some we don't even THINK about) when making a saber and looking for "apples to apples" visual comparisons... especially through photos:

1. Photo settings. Every camera has a different tendency toward red or green or blue, some over-expose more, less, are clearer, are not, pick up more ranges of the nm of light, etc. So this is a BIIIIIIIGGGG deal when making "apples to apples".
2. Emitter size & how far the blade goes inside.
3. Blade size OD, ID, length, tip & mirror type.
4. The diffuser. Duh! HUUUUGGGE!
5. Ambient lighting. There is *always* ambient light, I don't care if you're in a dark room. Wavelengths are wavelengths.
6. Flash. Which brings me to camera flashes--something Edwin, Erv and I need to study... there are different types, and all of them ALSO emit different wavelengths, and thus, illuminate the subject of a photo with a "bias" of particular light waves... but maybe not others.
7. Battery solution.
8. Driver.
9. If the driver is "pulsing" the LED randomly (such as Erv's or the visually tough-to-tell Corbin's), imagine any given moment that the photo is taken. You might be "looking" at 1000ma draw... you might be looking at 800. Or 500. I don't know. Do you??!?!
10. LED type.
11. LED color.
12. LED bin within that type & color.
13. Optics, anyone? Are they really tight on there, or a bit loose? Acting efficiently or losing more light than that of the saber next door?

I'm sure there are a few more, but you get the point. There are JUNKLOADS of factors that come into play on whether a saber is going to look any given way.

One thing is for certain--if the stars were to align, and you were somehow to get EVERY SINGLE ITEM ABOVE all perfect perfect perfect... well, there would be your perfect saber, lit exactly the way you like.

However, since any given factor up there could be slightly "mucked up", I'd say all of us LED nerds are stuck with "apples to oranges" comparisons, with the possible quasi-exception of taking photos of our own sabers with our own cameras and changing only ONE variable at a time for comparison.

Even then--you run into problem #9 above unless you're going direct drive or something.

[Eandori]

Hey Novastar,

you can always get past blade flicker on photo issues by either going direct drive or setting up the camera for long exposure. But for the issue of certain wavelengths effecting the camera differently, there is not much that can be done.

The true best way to compare is use the same saber, same room lighting, same camera, etc. etc. Just change out the Luxeon LED and run each at their optimal current. Heck, I may end up doing exactly that...

[Novastar]

Exactly, Edwin... I understand that perfectly. It's pretty clear that testing your own saber with LED x and then swapping it with LED y (if both LEDs "want" the current being shot out)... will give you a great comparsion with only ONE variable--the LED color/type.

HOWEVER... I mean to say that when (for example):

Bob takes a photo of his saber...
and Edwin takes a photo of his...

Almost no matter HOW you slice it--the apples to apples possibility is pretty much long gone.

[Eandori]

Hey again guys,

I have been working on updating my custom prototype saber, and I took a few shots of how even the blade was. I compared it to a few Master Replicas, one stock and one red lux III converted. Since these pictures were taken with the same camera, at the same time, in the same room, side by side it makes a for a good comparison.

First off, I'm really pleased how evenly lit my custom blade is. Beyond that, I'm now fully satisfied that just because your LED is red, does not mean your blade will be flaring at the hilt.

BTW, for blade diffusion on my proto2 saber I have a 5 degree lens, Erv's diffuser film, a thick-walled polyc. tube from TCSS, and a few layers of cellophane inside Erv's diffuser film.


EDIT: Uploaded the other picture, here it is!!


Note in the dark room image how brightly the blade is flaring along it's entire length. That is a tell-tale sign of how much light is coming out and from where.

[DACOTA]

Oh my goodnes,there is a huge difference in the mace than your custom,I mean a little less than halfway on the blade of the mace it dims down to the brightness of the maul fx,wow! What kind of blade is on the mace conversion,the stock mr?I know the proto saber has a k2 but thats not the only reason the blade is so much more even than the mace right?

[Novastar]

Right... using Corbin's film vs. a cellophane (gift wrap) wrap... vs. a mixture... all of these give a differing result, some of which include a more even blade diffusion.

Ultimately, it is up to the owner to decide what they like the most...

[DACOTA]

Yeah I thought so but I still want to know what the blade is on the mace,I mean its so bad[no offense] compared to the eveness of his custom.