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Thread: Resonance -- let's get this hammered out!

  1. #1
    Council Member Novastar's Avatar
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    Default Resonance -- let's get this hammered out!

    Ok folks... I know very little about resonance other than the following:

    1. Space in front of your speaker is just as important as space behind it.

    2. There is a certain amount of cavity that is "ideal" given any speaker setup. Although that is tough to find, and what we're talking about.

    Does anyone out there have some really good data on how to go about creating a very "tuned" resonance cavity? I know Erv has hinted toward it in his .pdf, but naturally this is a detailed subject.

    I can safely say that resonance plays a *GIGANTOR* role in making an identical speaker in saber X... sound far, far better than saber Y.

    It's true that a better speaker = a better speaker... but you can also have:

    * Average speaker + GREAT setup = FANTASTIC sound
    vs.
    * Fantastic spaker + POOR setup = Average sound

    Thoughts? Best to reply here if you really know what the heck is going on with sound. I've already done a bunch of experimental "amateur" tests that simply are via my ears... using an apples to apples comparison of the same speaker in like 5 differing resonance setups.
    ~~ GREYTALE NOVASTAR (Writer, Director, Choreographer, Sound Designer, Actor, Saber Designer, Vocal Artist)
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    xwingband's Avatar
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    Default

    I'm not so big on the back of the speaker. In my experience it's not nearly as important as the business end of the speaker.

    The most important thing is a seal with the chamber. I've used everything from a liberal application of glue to o-rings.

    Otherwise a general 1" or so has fine to me. Taking more than that has been overkill. It starts to trade lowering the pitch for volume, almost begins to muffle the clarity.

    I don't think we can get it to any science... you're not going to calculate the pipe length and correlate it with the pitch that it will equal (and thus resonate best). If anyone did... I'd pat them on the back and tell them to get a life.

    I'd like to start messing with speakers, but like a lot of things (switches?) there are too many options and then they go to waste sitting in my box 'o stuff.
    RED LEADER Standing by!

  3. #3
    Jedi Council Member vortextwist's Avatar
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    Default

    I agree with x to about the air behind is not as important as the ability to get it flowing out. All of the sound comes from the front of the speakers. It's just like my bass cab, the pulsing of the speaker is what makes the sound we hear. Sure you need a little behind but only so the speaker can move freely.


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  4. #4
    Jedi Padawan jjshumpert's Avatar
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    Default resonance

    the rule of thumb with speaker design is to have a closed air space for the speaker to draw from and a larger ported space for the sound to escape from whatever its mounted in. having room on the basket side of the speaker in our applications is not an issue when it comes down to it since the speaker is so small it needs less that 1/16th of an inch cubic space for projection. take my mr luke conversions, i mount the driver in a plastic tube that is just large enough for the sound module and relay. behind the module towards the pommel is the recharge pack, and the pommel is sealed off with fiberglass making it imposible to actually draw air from that end of the hilt. i then mount the speaker to the top of the module which places it just behind the first blackened section of the grooved forward grip. i make 6 equilateral cuts per ring along this entire section and the sound for the saber is done. once everything is hooked up and you fire the saber it is loud enough that you cant hear a stock luke sitting beside my setup, which i would say is a great improvement considering the luke is one of their louder hilts.

    kinda off subject but how bout sending over one of these uber speakers for me to play around with? sounds like a great coil and i have some over the top hilts i want to try it in...

  5. #5
    Council Member Novastar's Avatar
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    Thanks guys... I'll be reviewing all this in detail to be sure of what everyone is saying and see about how it differs (or is similar) to what I did for the Flange v3. I tried to give it as much resonance as possible without overdoing it and losing good sound.
    ~~ GREYTALE NOVASTAR (Writer, Director, Choreographer, Sound Designer, Actor, Saber Designer, Vocal Artist)
    ~~ Balance of Power, EP I: "Into The Lion's Den"
    ~~ Balance of Power, EP II: "Ashes of The Phoenix"
    ~~ The Crystal Focus Sound CD Compendiums... are HERE! ~~
    ~~ Nova & Caine's Staged Combat System... comin' SOON!
    ~~ Crystal Focus Wiring Guide

  6. #6

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    X can tell me to get a life, but the simple (math) way to do it would be to find the average frequency of the most common sound (in this case, the hum), then calculate the 1/4 wave distance to come up with ideal resonance chamber length. In theory, it should give an approximate 7dB increase. That may not sound significant, but a 3dB increase is an effective doubling of sound pressure levels, so 7dB is pretty significant in fact.

  7. #7
    Council Member Novastar's Avatar
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    HAH! Jon... that is *exactly* the kind of idea I'm looking for in this thread. Suh-weet.

    Thanks! I'll see what else everyone is coming up with and maybe we'll all have a way to find a simple (yet still somewhat mathematical) way to take sound from being good to uber-excellent if the conditions are correct.

    To me, this makes a VERY big difference in the experience of a saber, especially if you'd like to impress someone with how this whole technology works.

    Sabers without sound... just aren't impressive to anyone outside the field. They look at it like "it's just a light--what's the big deal". lol
    ~~ GREYTALE NOVASTAR (Writer, Director, Choreographer, Sound Designer, Actor, Saber Designer, Vocal Artist)
    ~~ Balance of Power, EP I: "Into The Lion's Den"
    ~~ Balance of Power, EP II: "Ashes of The Phoenix"
    ~~ The Crystal Focus Sound CD Compendiums... are HERE! ~~
    ~~ Nova & Caine's Staged Combat System... comin' SOON!
    ~~ Crystal Focus Wiring Guide

  8. #8

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    Yes but the majority of people out there dont care if its got sound.

  9. #9

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    I don't agree with that... the sound is like half of the experience (ok, it's MY opinion). Can't play with a silent saber anymore...

    Jonitus, good point... didn't you you've dealt with impedancy adaptation.
    I'm going to measure the resonance point of the speakers I'm using (the usual one coming with CF and the new one novastar and I have tested). Then I'll calculate the distance maximizing the sound to get a 1/4 of wave adaptation. I'm pretty sure it will match the cavity of my last saber (I'll post pics and videos very soon) cause it's SO LOUD !!!
    Erv'


    Quote Originally Posted by Hasid Lafre
    Yes but the majority of people out there dont care if its got sound.
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  10. #10

    Default

    The wonderful thing about calculating the 1/4 wave distance is that you are putting a quantitative spin on what has been a largely qualitative process. Yes, when you play with the chamber length and get it loud enough and sounding good enough, you are doing essentially the same thing as running the calculation.

    It would be nice to have a chart or something that reads like:

    For sound board "x" with speaker size "y", chamber length should be "z"

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