Tri Rebel Questions

[RobieRob]

So long story short, I have 3 boys. 4, 7, 9. We just got done watching all the star wars movies and now everything's turned into a saber (wooden spoons, my tools, sticks, you name it)...and they've all broken. I decided to jump on youtube to see if anyone's built a saber worth dueling....which led me here; and I've been reading for days. I've soldered SMD LED's on the X-Box to change colors, and fixed tons of electronics over the years, so this is all right up my alley. My issue is I have no experience with sabers and I have to build these to be fairly equal so no one is less than the other (might actually cause a civil war in my house if this we're to happen). Anyway, I've got it figured down to tri rebels, Nano Biscotte, Power Extender for FoC, FoC from white LED. The part where I get messed up is which tri rebels to get. I see the tri rebels on the Luxeon website put out more lumens than the one's Tim sells, but why if that's the case does he not sell them? I have to be missing something here? These are the ones I have picked out on Luxeons website with there appropriate specs. I know not to link outside websites, and FWIW, I'll be buying everything else from Tim anyway. Any opinions on why these are bad choices are appreciated, and remember, I'm choosing these to be fairly equal in design, probably not very easy considering three kids, three different favorite colors.

All 3 powered by 3.7v 3400mAh with Nano Biscotte

1st.
Cool White (180 lm) / Green (161 lm) / Green (161 lm)
White is 3.2FV at 700mA (1ohm R)
Green is 3.5FV at 1000mA (2x 1ohm R)?


2nd.
ANSI White (200 lm) / Deep Red (580mW) / Deep Red (580mW)
White is 3.5FV at 1000mA (1ohm R)
Deep Red is 2.8FV at 700mA (2x 1.5ohm R)?


3rd.
Neutral White (180 lm) / Royal-Blue (840mW) / Royal-Blue (840mW)
White is 3.2FV at 700mA (1ohm R)
Royal Blue is 3.51FV at 1000mA (1ohm R)


So....someone school me on the way of the saber (I'm prepared for it, won't be the first time I've felt far less superior, won't be the last). If I can't do this, then why? I'll be the first to admit, I'm not an electrical engineer, and I'm not asking to be spoon fed. I fully understand to search, and I believe that it's clear that I have.

Again, FWIW, if I clicked on tri-rebel in the store, and they had GGW listed, I think I would have happily bought that and been well on my way,....along with RBRBW and RRW.

Thanks, awesome site.

[cannibal869]

The luxeon website may give you some slightly more customizable options in terms of what color combinations are available, but that may also cost you some extra $$. The ones Tim sells in the store are perfectly fine for saber dueling use. Also, realize that lumens is only part of the story. Yes, they do matter, but to the naked human eye, most people can't tell the difference between things that are even 100 lumens apart. EDIT: IMHO, the custom color combinations would be the only reason to get them from luxeon.

We tend to suggest overdriving the LEDs here - for instance, the 700mA rating - most of us tend to give that LED 1A. It gets a touch hotter temperature wise, but is also brighter as a result. There have been many comments and calculations about the reduction in LED life (but the expected lifetime is so long to begin with, that it's really not much of a consideration).

The other part of the equation, and probably the more important part, is getting the right optics for the LED. I believe the average angle is usually recommended somewhere between 5 and 15 degrees, although it does sort of depend upon how long a blade you plan on using as well. You could have an uber bright LED, but without the proper lens, your blade will look horrible and washed out. Dunno if this helps you at all,
-C

[RobieRob]

First off, thank you for the reply

Are you saying that the 18deg lens found here;
http://www.thecustomsabershop.com/Lu...Lens-P778.aspx
wouldn't fit?

The only reason that I had the idea to go with 700mA for the FoC with the green and blue sabers was because it's my understanding that the deep red might not be as bright. I figured I could try to balance it out a hair with a brighter clash.

I'm just not sure the reason Tim only has a limited selection of Tri rebels? For everything else, I'm buying from Tim (blades, sound card, etc.)

Edit: I've read so many posts saying not to run Red's at anything more than 700mA, but can they be overdriven at all?

[Forgetful Jedi Knight]

First off, thank you for the reply

Are you saying that the 18deg lens found here;
http://www.thecustomsabershop.com/Lu...Lens-P778.aspx
wouldn't fit?

The only reason that I had the idea to go with 700mA for the FoC with the green and blue sabers was because it's my understanding that the deep red might not be as bright. I figured I could try to balance it out a hair with a brighter clash.

I'm just not sure the reason Tim only has a limited selection of Tri rebels? For everything else, I'm buying from Tim (blades, sound card, etc.)

Edit: I've read so many posts saying not to run Red's at anything more than 700mA, but can they be overdriven at all?

That lens will work ok with the Tri-rebels.

Tim only carries items that he things will sell well. 2 of one color and white are the items that tend to sell the best.

Reds really can't be overdriven much (some have pushed it to 750mA), or else pop goes the LEDs.

[RobieRob]

Has anyone tried soldering the LED's directly to a base? Probably heat from underneath, fluxless solder, and hot air from the top?

This would be fairly cost effective to try numerous color variations all across the board...

[Forgetful Jedi Knight]

Has anyone tried soldering the LED's directly to a base? Probably heat from underneath, fluxless solder, and hot air from the top?

This would be fairly cost effective to try numerous color variations all across the board...

To what base, a star?

If you want to try "all the colors", just get a PC 3.0 with a color extender and an RGrB LED. that way you would get all your colors.

[Silver Serpent]

There are a few people in this hobby who make their own multi-die LEDs by soldering emitters to stars. It's not the easiest thing to do. It usually involves a reflow oven or similar setup.

[RobieRob]

Again, I appreciate the answers. I have worked with a rigged oven before. I can't go the pc route, as I need to build 3,.. I'm not that rich. I was just looking at all the possibilities. Thanks guys.

[RobieRob]

Here's what I'm thinking...griddle.jpg

[dgdve]

IMHO these days...

It's simply not beneficial to reflow your own LED's... (sure if you want to try to make a custom Quad but your always going to be restricted by your lens solution)

A guy names X-wingband used to custom make the Tri's (like 5 years ago), now you just buy them. There cheap and st this point if you need a such a commonly available led your better off to just BUY it. (As you know they can do any configuration you like and its cheaper then wasting your time setting up a hot plate).

Tim sells the LED's that are most commonly requested and are the best for MHS applications (All very bright and reliable).. Also when tossing an LED into a current TCSS order (its loads cheaper then adding the shipping on top of that from another company).

The RRW, BBW, GGW or RGB offer the full range of what you "need" for a saber.. Sure there will always be more (for the big kids, but not at that age, lol)

LED tech moves.. Its fluid like water.. Like your kids, they will change and be better then before!

So I wouldn't buy ANY youngster an expensive saber AND until they can help to tackle a project such as this.. Your really adding jobs to yourself and making it much harder then it should be...

They aren't helping or learning anything yet (soldering.. Maths.. Electrical theory).. So just build it as easy and cheap as possible...

In fact do it that way on purpose so when they want them upgraded you can turn the upgrade into a great father/kids learning experience.. (like lets see whats inside.. and teaching them about a simple circuit and about Ohm's law about resistance and calulations... Maybe the oldest will be into math in school enough to follow it.. Will be VERY cool)

Either way I think it will be much easier (and cheaper) to simply toss the related LED's into the box.

____
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And Why Deep Red, OR Royal Blue????

Deep Red isn't all that.. sure its bloodier kinda... But the Tri Red is sweet (look at some of those RRW sabers and youll see).. AND the Royal blue is a misconception...

Tri Rebel Blue is AWESOME.. The ONLY reason you want the royal blue is because the blue doesn't mix well (for color mix sabers)... So there us absolutely nothing wrong wit Tri Rebel Blue (again go check the sabers on youtube..) The Royal is only slightly more accurate when used in conjuction with RICE and other RGB colors... That's it

I hope that helps! (Id just order the TCSS led's and be done... They are youngsters.. Leave all the reflow your own smd led stuff for your own "Master's" blade.. You know sound.. blinkies.. the works)