Black Blade development...

[Matt Thorn]

Thanks, LDM. Looking forward to seeing the results. I have myself perfected a dark-core, dark-outline blade, which requires an empty polycarb tube and a dark room. No LED necessary!

TimeRender: Touché. Senti's additional photos and explanation would seem to indicate that he is using a gimmick that is similar in concept, if not in actual execution, to what you did there. Which would be a major disappointment.

Getting back to what I said about the theoretical possibility of a true dark-core blade, the more I think of it, the more I think it cannot be done with traditional blade material. When you put a polycarb tube in a hilt with no diffuser, you get a "dark core," but by no means a black core, because even the tiniest irregularity in the surface of the tube is lit up to some extent. In theory, you might be able to create an effect like that with a tube of glass polished to telescope-optic quality. But it is also possible that even the edges of such a tube would be invisible, and light would be transmitted only to the opposite end of the tube, just like what happens with optic fiber. There might be some kind of transparent material out there that would show light only in the cross-section of the tube directly facing the viewer, but I've never seen such stuff.

Any experts in optics on the forums?

[Shadar Al'Niende]

No. As a matter of fact I have not. Even as I write this I have only seen the first pic, which COULD easily be reproduced by simply applying some black electrical tape to a regular blade. I'll have to go look at his newer pics. However, it sounds as though he has in fact only been able to create a blade that appears this way from one angle, which suggests that I was correct all along. Nevertheless, I don't feel the need to retract or apologize for anything, since all that I stated was a realistic level of doubt over some incredibly vague claims. If he turns out to have been telling the truth all along, he will vindicate himself and nothing I said will have mattered one bit.

Edit: I've taken a look at the pics and I stand by what I said. It looks like he made a lot of fuss over nothing. It looks exactly like he has just used something opaque on two sides of the blade to shield the light. It probably is just electrical tape. He hasn't in my eyes created a black bladed saber, nor has he done anything that hasn't been mentioned on any of the other black blade threads before. And THAT is why sometimes it is acceptable to call shenanigans.

Edit Edit: I have decided to accept your challenge to reproduce the effect. It took me a little longer than I expected because I couldn't find the electrical tape. It was a rush job, so it's slightly crooked, but so was the tape in one of Senti's pictures. Plus I didn't have the benefit of all of the "development" that Senti did. I guess that means mine also has "several steps to go through before the final stages are complete". With talk like that you would think he had designed a new shuttle for Nasa, not just stuck tape to a blade. Anyway, without further adieu, my results...

classic.... thanks for the chuckle TR

[TimeRender]

I eat bowls of snark for breakfast. You're welcome Shad.

[Sunrider]

Edit Edit: I have decided to accept your challenge to reproduce the effect. It took me a little longer than I expected because I couldn't find the electrical tape. It was a rush job, so it's slightly crooked, but so was the tape in one of Senti's pictures. Plus I didn't have the benefit of all of the "development" that Senti did. I guess that means mine also has "several steps to go through before the final stages are complete". With talk like that you would think he had designed a new shuttle for Nasa, not just stuck tape to a blade. Anyway, without further adieu, my results...

LOL he he

[Goltar Bias]

Honestly looking at the pic is the post i dont think it is electrical tape but rather a more complicated, time consumeing, and expesive process. Where he took several polycarb tubes and cut them into 4 sections length wise the matched the 2 clear to 2 black. With the black being coated in a fully reflective manner to produce a true black and have the light spill out through the clear. Which would give you a lot of light to produce a very even edge. But this is just my 2 cents on it. Personaly I think the lenticular idea proposed here http://forums.thecustomsabershop.com...ead.php?t=9188 would produce the desired effect better.

[TimeRender]

I'm certain that that is not the case Goltar. You can clearly see in two of the pics that he applied the tape crookedly, and in a few pics you can clearly see the sides that were not taped off. He may not actually have used tape, but he clearly applied the same concept.

[Matt Thorn]

I had completely missed that older thread on the subject, but I think that Goltar is correct that the lenticular lens concept is, so far, the closest thing to a conceivable real-world solution. Whether the light source is transmitted up the wall of the tube, or the inside of the tube, you would need a setup in which, no matter where the viewer stands or how many viewers there are, only the light on the outer edge would be visible. Another possibility that leaps to mind is some kind of Polaroid effect, but I have no idea how it could actually be implemented. There is a kind of film sometimes used on windows that makes the window opaque (white) when looking at it straight on, but transparent when seen at a sharp enough angle. (I used this on a bathroom window in my previous home. Too bad I had a major fall-out with the architect who installed it, or I could ask him a black version. )

A black version of such film (assuming it is possible and exists), wrapped around a blade might achieve the "dark core, bright aura" effect easily. ("Privacy film" used on mobile phone displays does the opposite, making them transparent only when viewed straight on, but opaque [blackish] when seen from an angle.)

But, whether Senti is using black tape (He says he isn't) or doing something as labor-intensive as Goltar suggests, it would seem, at this point, to be a gimmick, analogous to the "X-Ray Glasses" they used to advertise in the back of comic books versus a high-tech full-body scanner of the kind they use in some airports these days. If you squint and use your imagination, you can convince yourself that it kinda looks like the sabers in the video game, but still...

Time will tell.

Or not.

EDIT: Come to think of it, in the bathroom window example I mentioned, that wasn't film applied to regular glass: it was a property of the glass itself. So much for wrapping it around something.

EDIT: Actually, there is such a film. But it only "fogs", like frosted glass, and it allows light to pass through, so while the effect on a saber blade might (or might not) be interesting, it certainly wouldn't result in a "dark core". Come to think of it, this might be an interesting diffuser for an LED-ladder blade. Hm...

[KuroChou]

Anybody ever heard of "total internal reflection"?
It's the property of light that allows fiber optics to work, where the optic cable in question appears unlit, except at the ends and any defects in the cable (breaks, scratches, etc.).
I thought about "dark core" blades, by using just that: a dark core.
A regular polyC blade with an opaque interior would clearly be black in the center, but the plastic walls would still carry the light just the same, giving a dark core with illuminated edges.
The edge effect would be caused by the addition of light.
If you look at a regular blade, the edges appear thicker than the center, simply because they are (1/2" visible material, instead of 1/8").
If you assume the light contained by the polyC follows this pattern, the edges would appear substantially brighter than the core, even though they possess the exact same light density.

This doesn't explain how he got such crisp lines, and almost completely discredits it as his method, but it might still be worth exploring on it's own.

[TimeRender]

Ok, seriously, I JUST explained why that won't work Kuro. I'm not enjoying having a second thread on this subject...

An opaque inner tube WILL NOT create this effect. It has been suggested about 100 times, and it has been thoroughly refuted.

[Onli-Won Kanomi]

Timerender is correct and to save him the bother I'll explain that IF there is a dark core with the walls carrying the light you won't be able to see the dark core THROUGH the light.

Put something black behind a light bulb, turn it on, can you see its darkness THROUGH light?

No.