So whats the advantages of a Seoul P4?

[Count Malik]

Hello everyone, i'v been trying to decide weather or not I should get a Seoul

P4? How bright are they and how well do they handle color disks? And what

are some good places (fast shipping) that sell them? Thanks!8)

MTFBWY

[xl97]

I woudl say if your looking into the WHITE LED... then a P4 is the only way to go..

I haventy wired mine up but every pic I have seen and every thread I have read boasts the awesome brightness of the mighty P4 with the same power requirements of a Lux III..

I think with a P4 some of the darker colors/filters that were too much for other whites will work better now..

[Shadeslinger]

I can't wait to try the P4 myself. Like xl97, I've seen pics of filtered P4s and they look impressive. The pics I've seen of luxIII (and even some k2) whites filtered were very...unimpressive. Actually, I was just browsing xwings site yesterday and he has a pic of an Anakin conversion using a P4 w/ a blue filter. It looked great.

[Jak'Kan-Ur]

I bought a White LED what and I have the discs as well.
What do you all think about the discs colors? do they come out good or? thanks.

[xwingband]

I can't wait to try the P4 myself. Like xl97, I've seen pics of filtered P4s and they look impressive. The pics I've seen of luxIII (and even some k2) whites filtered were very...unimpressive. Actually, I was just browsing xwings site yesterday and he has a pic of an Anakin conversion using a P4 w/ a blue filter. It looked great.

That's actually a purple. The camera like to make it look blue.

IMO purple wasn't worth it until I went with a Seoul. Ambers were disappointing as ever because I wanted Yellow, Seoul's made that perfect.

Basically, it's a heck of a lot more output for your input. It's the same as a III electrically, but gives 4 times as much.

[Eandori]

Yeah, as usual Xwing is right on the money. I just powered up my first Seoul P4 white this morning and I'm running it at 1 amp in my Proto3B lightsaber (the one with a red blade in my signature picture). First kneejerk reaction, it seems about as bright to the eyeball as a blue luxeon V at 1 amp. Which is actually pretty bright. I can EASILY say it's much brighter then a luxeon III or K2 white. Those are not even close. I think the red luxeon III and Green luxeon V still outdo it though. At least... that's what it seems like so far.

I not only got the Seoul P4 white, but I also got some tri-color LED's. With all 3 colors in 1 bulb actually, so it will work with our standard optics! I have not powered them up at full current yet, so I can't say how bright they are. I think each color is maxed at like 350mA or something. I did notice that all the silkscreen on the LED for + and - was reversed on all my LED's though :)

I think the Seoul P4 is currently the ONLY way to go for white+filters. I'll try to color match it to my red/green/blue luxeons and take some comparison videos. But first I can't wait to try it with purple... Mace Windu style baby!

[Eandori]

Well, I've been trying the Seoul P4 a decent amount now. It for sure the brightest white LED I have used so far... but to my eyes it's not what I was hoping for. I'm using the TCSS and Plecter Labs filters that can be purchsed from those website + the Seoul P4 at 1 amp and although I do get the colors the blade is very dim once filtered still. The native color LED's are still by a longshot better then a filtered 240 lumen white.

For the colors you can't achive with luxeon (purple, yellow) Seoul P4 + filter does appear to be the best option. The Seoul P4 + amber filter might even give the luxeon III amber a run for it's money! But when pitted against the best Green/Red/Blue luxeons it loses badly.

If I had to take a shot in the dark guess... I would guess we need something around a 400 lumen of white LED + green filter to compete with what a Luxeon V green can do with no filter. Again, this is just a guess.

As a side note, I remember when I opened up the Mace Windu master replica I discovered that the purple blade was achived by having a red plastic filter over an over-driven blue string of LED's. Wanting to try the same thing I used some red filters on my blue luxeon V saber. The results were a royal blue shade, and no light coming out at all. I'm thinking there might be the "magic number" filter that works, but I just don't have that many filter options for red filter on blue LED.

I need to order that sample package of filters. What was it called again?

[Malaki Skywalker]

I need to order that sample package of filters. What was it called again?

They are Lee filters, I take it you mean the ones in the little yellow booklet ?

Hope this helps :)

[xl97]

Eandori-

Lee Filters shoudl still send you a sample swatch books (tons of colors)

you can also try to google liht filters.. I think I got some ATLAS ones and another brand. (I just look at their wedsites and see if hey send sample swatches out..most did..some wanted money though)

anyways.. if you cant find some.. let me know I have an extra.

[Voice]

If I had to take a shot in the dark guess... I would guess we need something around a 400 lumen of white LED + green filter to compete with what a Luxeon V green can do with no filter. Again, this is just a guess.

Looks like the P7 might be the current holy-grail for sabers then (assuming you can deal with it's steeper battery requirements (2800mA, 3.6-4.3V, 700-900 lumen).

[xwingband]

"holy grail"???

White + filters will never replace colored LED if mearly for saturation.

Our eyes see changes on logs. So to appear double as bright as a 100 lumen white it'd need to be 1000 lumens. Add to the fact that each filter acts differently in how much it filters and even some 900 lumen LED may not appear to be as crazy as you may think.

Say a 80% Red filter is on a 900 lumen White. That's 180 we'll see assuming there is no loss in the optics (90% efficiancy there). Next to the normal 190 Red-Orange III you'd be wondering what's up!

Change to a 15% Yellow though and you'll be blown away.

[Eandori]

Makes sense. Seems right :)

Yeah, I can't wait for P7's!!! Unfortunately though... I may have to wait for optics for the P7's...

[Obi-Dar Ke-Gnomie]

I have to agree with Xwing. I have a P4 with a yellow filter, and it looks great. When I tried it with "darker" colors, it was nothing to write home about.

I managed to make a pretty good pink, a decent amber, and a nice pale blue that I kind of like, but other than that, if you're trying for red, blue, or green, I would recommend just using the LED of that color and forget about white with filters.

I'll take some photos and post them later if anyone wants to see the colors I got.

[Novastar]

Without ever having tried the goal of yellow with a filter (but have tried all sorts of reddish/blue/purple/fuscia combos back in the day with a Lux III white... WAAAY back in 2006...)...

...I would say that X-Wing and Obi-Dar are totally on the money with the whole "yellow" thing.

The *LESS* light you need to filter out to get the desired color... the *BETTER* your result will be.

And since SOME white LEDs already sort of favor that yellowish tint... it's not a farcry to get yellow. Purple... I don't know. Pretty tough. And trying to get REALLY deep colors--good luck. They'll just look like arse.

[xwingband]

Ooo, that's a good point. Most of what we use are cool whites which tend to be bluish. I haven't directly seen a drastic difference (for lack of looking), but some whites are "warm" which are meant to be more yellow. Warms are made to mimic normal lighting better.

[Voice]

"holy grail"???

White + filters will never replace colored LED if mearly for saturation.

Our eyes see changes on logs. So to appear double as bright as a 100 lumen white it'd need to be 1000 lumens. Add to the fact that each filter acts differently in how much it filters and even some 900 lumen LED may not appear to be as crazy as you may think.

Say a 80% Red filter is on a 900 lumen White. That's 180 we'll see assuming there is no loss in the optics (90% efficiancy there). Next to the normal 190 Red-Orange III you'd be wondering what's up!

Change to a 15% Yellow though and you'll be blown away.

Sure, I may have over-stated it a bit, but if you assume a 75% red filter, you're looking at 225 lumen (202 if you assume your 90% efficiency with the optics). Next to a 190 red-orange Lux 3, it'll be a bit brighter.

Then again, I've got to assume that the light lost to the optics will be essentially the same proportion regardless of the LED color, so if you lose 10% on the white after the red filter, you'd lose about 10% on the red without the filter as well.

It looks like each color will have a different break-even point on getting a better color from a specialized LED as compared to the P7, but it looks like there should be a bit of room to play with before you get that far. As soon as I can find a P7 on a star, I'll be getting one for my saber.

My hilt parts should be arriving Monday, and I'll be ordering the basic electronics soon. (Probably with a P4 for now since I'm looking to end up with a yellow blade.)

Regardless, I figure it's worth checking out. If I can end up with a saber that I can change to a range of colors simply by swapping filters so much the better if I ever change my mind. If it's not bright enough for that, I can always drop back down to a P4, keep it yellow, and relish the longer battery life.

[Obi-Dar Ke-Gnomie]

If you want to do yellow, check out garage sales and stores that sell used sporting goods. The yellow filter I use is simply a disc cut from a pair of yellow ski goggles. I like a paler yellow, so I only use one disc, but if you double it up, it's a nice rich yellow.

I just got home from my second job, but I'll take those pictures, and probably post them tomorrow.

[Arm on Fire]

Just hooked up one tonight with a 1000 mA puck, I was expecting more, dont get me wrong, Its brighter than a K2 white, but I couldnt get any thing I liked but yellow.

[Eandori]

Just hooked up one tonight with a 1000 mA puck, I was expecting more, dont get me wrong, Its brighter than a K2 white, but I couldnt get any thing I liked but yellow.
Yep, this was about my findings as well.

[xl97]

both my P4's are 'duds' direct from DealExtreme.. (I wish I could be disappointed like you guys) :(

;)


I guess I got faulty LED's? not even direct batt. wires to the LED make it light up..

I even tried the reverse polarity pads like the site suggested... no love. :(

lol

[Eandori]

I just got the filters from TCSS in the mail, I guess I was using Plecter Labs filters before. The purple filter from TCSS was much lighter in color, allowing more light to pass. So the purple color is not as deep, but it's much brighter and still purple enough for me.

So... in short I like the Seoul P4 + TCSS purple filter. :)

Red Lux III/Green Lux V/Blue Lux V still pwn it though.

[Tom Starkiller]

I even tried the reverse polarity

Huh, that used to ALWAYS work for Geordi. xD

[xl97]

Huh, that used to ALWAYS work for Geordi. xD


Star Trek?


anyways.. the P4's I got were JUNK.. and its taking forever to even make contact to get new ones shipped. :(

[Obi-Dar Ke-Gnomie]

Here are the pictures I promised last week. Sorry it took so long. It's been a busy time.

These are all plastic filters cut from stuff I found. The yellow and amber were circles cut from ski goggles. The red was cut from the package my Hasbro Vader came in. I don't remember what the blue plastic came from, but it was similar stuff. All of the pictures were taken with the same camera settings.

I didn't bother showing what one amber filter looked like. It was kind of a sickly peach color.

The 1 red filter makes a decent pink, and it's pretty bright, though not as bright as the yellow. 2 reds were dismal. My Lux I red in my PVC saber is way brighter.

Purple was pointless with these filters. It was a nice color, but you could hardly see it. With another filter it might be better. I'll take some pictures with Tim's filters and post them.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2007-1/1236148/color_filters_a.jpg
http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2007-1/1236148/color_filters_b.jpg

[strengthofrage]

I have a P4 and a pack of filters from the shop, I am going to agree that yellow is about the only impressive color. Purple is the most obvious and popular reason to try a white + filter but I was not even slightly impressed. The other colors (aside from yellow) can all be achieved with single color LED's and I guess I just like the color saturation of those better than the option of changing colors at will (second reason to want to try white + filters). Personally, the quick disconnects that Tim offers achieve the swapping option and work just fine for me. I will say that if you like yellow or just a white blade, P4 is awesome.

EDIT: Those are some nice comparison pics Obi-Dar. You're right, the purple is really nice and rich, its just a shame that it isn't brighter :(

[Count Malik]

Thanks guys. I'm planning on using a green lux. V.;)

[Hasid Lafre]

if your dissapointed with the p4+filter then you prolly havent even tryed a luxIII with filters.

[Onli-Won Kanomi]

I have to agree yellow is the best filtered colour and I also quite like the TEAL filter disc from TCSS too...I have to admit the light pink disc is also a nice colour but i'm a guy so not in MY saber lol...maybe the one I make for my sister...;-)

[DDanDevious]

Im using a P4 with three of the filters from TCSS... you can get some really awesome colors by mixing and matching more than on disc... I got a really great orange, some interesting blues, and all kinds of stuff... some of course make the blade more dull, and others suprisingly dont block too much light and make for some cool colors. Experiment til you find something you like...

DDD

[Hasid Lafre]

lee filters are the best filters one can get so get them and be less dissapointed with the look.

[Slait]

I got a really great orange That's a pretty big relief. I was gonna order a Lux III till I heard these ordered, then I waited, then heard only bad things about the reds. Didn't know if it counted for Orange as well or not. :cool:

[LeMoel]

i agree 100 % that the p4 is impressive and very good to go with for a silver saber or a filtered saber HOWEVER... its not the only way.. theres the atlas cool white led .

it is a bit bright then the seoul p4 ,id say 20-30 lumens, and i feel that its perfect amount of brightness.. but where it lacks is it requires 7.5 volts, but i feel its worth it for those extra 20-30 lumens

[DDanDevious]

That's a pretty big relief. I was gonna order a Lux III till I heard these ordered, then I waited, then heard only bad things about the reds. Didn't know if it counted for Orange as well or not. :cool:

yeh im using two of the TCSS orange filters in a short 30in blade and it looks very nice...

DDD

[Count Malik]

Ha! Ha! my K2 is shot :( But I might use an MR board (yoda) with a P4 on custom rechargables! For my next saber!8-)

[Novastar]

What happened to your K2? Too much current? Or did it just up and quit?

As to a P4 with a Yoda board... hmm, I'm not sure if it would be driving it to its full brightness, but if around 900ma is right (I haven't checked) then you should be good. :)

[LeMoel]

and i donno abou being that excited for the p7 because i think it will just wash out the colors, i think p4 atlas are probly the two ideal leds

[Hasid Lafre]

I wouldent use an atles cause it needs 7.something volts. Dosent seem very efficent to me.

If I was gonna use something tha tneeds alot of voltage its gonna be a colored led.

[LeMoel]

your right it isn t the best for efficency,but it is brighter than the p4,and ive tryed 300-400 lumen white endor leds and they are just way to bright for filters, washes the colors right out.

but 300 lumens might work but if your getting near 350-400 i think it will be to bright

the atlas is like 272 which i find perfect

[Phiily Manyaan]

What would runtime be like with 4AA, 1000mA buckpuck, and white P4? I was using a yellow filter on a white lux3 and was fairly happy, ordered the amber lux3, too orange, want P4.

[Novastar]

In general, battery "mah" relates to if you are drawing a constant 1A from the cells, they will last that many hours.

So, 1000mah means 1 hour of runtime while under a 1A draw.

Remember: mA is *NOT* the same thing as "mah" (milli-ampere hours). One is a unit of measurement over TIME, the other is just the current.

I can't remember what a P4 draws, but I think it's 1A. Now sure, PWM drivers or maybe pucks will do some things that essentially extend the runtimes (CF does this quite a bit with all the light flickering!)...

...but my guess is that 1000mah batteries with a P4 drawing 1A... even with a puck... will yield approximately 1 hour of runtime.

[xwingband]

Nova has it right. I believe the stated 1000mAh he has is the buckpuck though. 4AA is vague... most NiMH and alkalines are around 2400mAh in AA size so I'd say 2 1/2 hours for sure. You'd get a little more with Alkalines vs. NiMH because of the voltage difference too.

[Obi-Dar Ke-Gnomie]

Your batteries may be different, but the AA NiMH batteries I have are 2650 mAH. If you are pulling a straight 1A out of them, theoretically, they'll last for 2.65 hours. I don't know at what point they'll drop below the forward voltage of the LED though. The puck will make adjustments to keep the LED going as long as possible.

If you are running a driver with PWM, it would probably last longer, but I have no idea how much longer. Some day, I'd like to charge up my sabers and leave them on, just to see how long they last.

Edit:

You two beat me to it while I was typing. LOL!