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scaloth
12-13-2005, 09:50 PM
would it be possible to wire additional LED's for the outside of the hilt to the same activation switch/battery source? i'm looking to put decorative LED's on the outside of the hilt on my next saber and wanted to know if this was possible. if it is, would you wire them parallel (if that's right) or not? meaning, something close to this poor diagram:

switch---\led---\led----\led (for blade)
battery--/------/-------/

sorry i'm way off base with this, but didn't know how else to word it

vadeblade
12-13-2005, 10:18 PM
I am assuming you are talking about regular radiosmack dimebag LEDs for decoration and one Luxeon LED for the blade.

My suggestion would be to use a DPDT (double pole, double throw - is that right?) switch. A switch that can turn on two seperate circuits with one flick. The string of decorative LED's will be on one circuit and the Luxeon on the other. And now my feeble attempt at ascii art...

http://www.geocities.com/projectstm/circuit.JPG

Notice the battery has two lines going to the switch. This could indicate a seperate smaller, less voltage battery pack for the decorative LEDs.

The decorative string should be wired parallel with a resistor for each LED

But I could be wrong, I am just about to embark on LED lightsabers too.



Lightsaber Warning Label: "CAUTION: Do NOT attempt to sharpen blade."

xwingband
12-13-2005, 10:21 PM
Yup, you'd have one connection from the battery to the switch. Next you could connect each LED to the switch and have a resistor for each one or one resistor that you'd have to calculate the value for connected to the the switch. I hope that wasn't confusing either.[:I]

EDIT: vadeblade beat me to it.[:p]

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vadeblade
12-13-2005, 10:35 PM
I'm learning a lot from here. I'm waiting for my ebay auctions to end and I am using my profits to make Strydur richer. Dual Luxeon here I come...[:D]

Lightsaber Warning Label: "CAUTION: Do NOT attempt to sharpen blade."

scaloth
12-13-2005, 10:45 PM
vade - yes i am talking about using regular radioshack LED's for the decorative part. i'd seen them used on other sabers, and how they were wired for that particular saber, but i had never seen them in conjunction with a blade.

xwing - any idea what size resistor i'd need for each LED?

xwingband
12-13-2005, 11:16 PM
Strydur at one point had a link up for a resistor calculator in the LED Q&A forum, but I believe he just replaced it with a list of all the ones needed for the 3W LEDs. *points to>>>* www.google.com

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GeluKhanGharr
12-14-2005, 04:49 AM
Vincent, in your diagram you put all leds in paralel. This would be accomplised with a SPST switch as well. Here is a simpler version of your diagram:
<font face="Courier New">
battery_____switch________________________________ _________
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...................</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">................</font id="yellow">resistor<font color="yellow">....</font id="yellow">resistor<font color="yellow">....</font id="yellow">resistor<font color="yellow">....</font id="yellow">resistor
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...................</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">..................</font id="yellow">LED<font color="yellow">.........</font id="yellow">LED<font color="yellow">.........</font id="yellow">LED<font color="yellow">.......</font id="yellow">Luxeon
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...................</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">...........</font id="yellow">|
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|___________________|___________|___________|_____ ______|
</font id="Courier New">

What you want is 2 circuits running in paralel off the same (logical) switch - one for the Luxeon and the other for the LEDs aranged in series. That way the LUX gets the full voltage, whereas the LEDs share it. Here's how I see it:

<font face="Courier New">
<font color="yellow">..................</font id="yellow">/------resistor-----Luxeon-------------------\
battery-----switch<font color="yellow">..............................................</font id="yellow">-
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">..............</font id="yellow">\------resistor-----LED------LED------LED----/<font color="yellow">.</font id="yellow">|
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">.................................................. ...........</font id="yellow">|
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|_________________________________________________ ____________|
</font id="Courier New">

Edit:
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">
This could indicate a seperate smaller, less voltage battery pack for the decorative LEDs.
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></font id="quote"></blockquote id="quote">

I missed this line, sorry. Anyway, small decorative LEDs don't draw much current, so my setup would save you from having a second battery pack.

Born of Sith, seduced by the light.
http://www.saloncatalina.com/images/signature.jpg

scaloth
12-22-2005, 01:23 PM
GeluKhanGharr,
do you think you could show which lead off the battery and the switch would go to each circuit? i know the battery pack will have pos/neg leads, but which one would go to the switch? i may be mistaken, but i thought that the standard on/off switch has the same pos/neg leads, and which would go to the luxeon led, and which to the decorative LED's?
thanks!

GeluKhanGharr
12-24-2005, 11:45 PM
scaloth
the line from the battery to the switch is the pos(+). the other lead off of the battery is the neg(-). Consider the switch a simple SPST, just a latching single contact on/off. Both resistors shown connect to one side, one pole of the switch and the battery to the other. The negative is permanently connected, it is only on hte positive wire that you install the switch. I better show you:

<font face="Courier New">
<font color="yellow">..................</font id="yellow">/----->resistor>-(+)Luxeon(-)----------------\
battery(+)--switch<font color="yellow">..............................................</font id="yellow">-
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">(-)<font color="yellow">............</font id="yellow">\----->resistor>-(+)LED(-)(+)LED(-)(+)LED(-)-/<font color="yellow">.</font id="yellow">|
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|<font color="yellow">.................................................. ...........</font id="yellow">|
<font color="yellow">...</font id="yellow">|_________________________________________________ ____________|
</font id="Courier New">


Born of Sith, seduced by the light.
http://www.saloncatalina.com/images/signature.jpg

scaloth
12-25-2005, 01:54 PM
thanks a bunch!!!

vadeblade
01-02-2006, 11:47 AM
Gelu,

your diagram shows the decorative LEDs wired in series with one resistor in front of the LED series. In my experience with LED strings (the radio shack 5mm type) this would require a higher voltage requirements for long strings (5 or more leds). And the last couple of leds in the string tends to be dim compared to the first in the series. A series setup also generates a lot of heat.

My diagram shows the decorative leds in parallel with a resistor for each decorative LED. This makes all the leds light up evenly with a lower source voltage.

Also, my diagram description states using a DPDT switch which means the Luxeon will be on a separate circuit isolated from the decorative led string. I think you may have mis-read my diagram.

Lightsaber Warning Label: "CAUTION: Do NOT attempt to sharpen blade." http://www.geocities.com/projectstm/lightsaber.html

LAN-ED-TUL
01-03-2006, 03:30 AM
okay, heres one you guys can answer for me: i have a project saber i will be working on in the near future. it will have a red/orange lux led powered by one of the hasbro saber sound boards.(one of the 8 dollar ones with motion and clash). now then, i would like to have 2 regular(radio shack) leds in the switch box. i'd like a green/constant, and a red/blinking led. the switch to fire the board, of course is a momentary. how can i hook those leds in the setup to come on when i fire the lux/sound at the same time using the single switch?

any help and diagram of hookup would be appreciated.

thanks,

Lan-Ed-Tul

GeluKhanGharr
01-04-2006, 01:53 AM
Lan-ed-tul,

do you not mind the flashing of the blade from the Hasbro module?
Couple of suggestions - see if you can create a setup that will fit 2 C or even D batteries. RED/ORANGE forward voltage is at 2.9 volts. If that doesn't work, get a 4 AA setup and create 2 3volt paralel circuits so you get higher amperage. 3 volts with a 1 Ohm resistor is perfect for a red/orange. 3volts is also the nominal curent for the hasbro board. The LED gets wired like that: Positive with a resistor directly from the battery and the negative from the wire labeled "LAMP" from the board. The same way you can wire your flashing deco LED - it will flash on clash at the same time with the blade. The other LED is a bit more problematic - if we could find a simple solution for this we wouldn't complain about the flashing of the blade. Well, one way it would be to wire it with the speaker. It would vary, but not really flash.

Vincent,
Setups with more than one battery pack make me cringe. The setup I suggested is also a good power indicator and you don't need to put the Lux on a separate circuit from the Deco LEDs. If voltage requirements are different, just regulate it with a Zener. But you could have multiple serialized deco LEDs add up to the same need as the Lux and wire them up like in my diagram to a single switch/single battery pack - 2 paralel circuits.

Born of Sith, seduced by the light.
http://www.saloncatalina.com/images/signature.jpg

LAN-ED-TUL
01-04-2006, 08:01 AM
gelu. nah the flashing blade clash dont bother me none. but one thing i said, maybe it was the way i said it, but it was the part about the blinking red led. the red blinker led blinks on its own when power is applied to it. i have used these in several simple electronic sabers i made. and i pair it up with a constant led. this is what i wanted to have on this saber, but it looks like i might have to wire a 2nd switch/on-off, and seperate battery to run it.

i done it that way in the one saber i posted that was a blue el blade with a red blinker and a constant blue led on the opposite side. 2 switches, but in that configuration i can flip on the leds, and have it hang on belt with those lit up. looks cool, and draws attention.

vadeblade
01-04-2006, 10:41 AM
Gelu,
Great reply. I had not considered that having the deco LEDs dim out at the end of a series would make a good indicator of source voltage. Very good point and I may apply that instead of building a Voltage indicator from scratch (Corbin's PLI is beyond my budget).
-V


Lightsaber Warning Label: "CAUTION: Do NOT attempt to sharpen blade." http://www.geocities.com/projectstm/lightsaber.html

scaarmor
01-05-2006, 10:35 PM
Hello all!
I wanted to chime in and see if someone knows- If you wire multiple LEDs in series and it gets the dimming towards the end effect, would a diffuser tube even it up. I guess a better question would be- How do they get the MR multi LED blades to get even light without a resistor for each LED? Sorry, I have never been inside of an MR blade and just wanted to know how they work to get some technical info (any info you have such as; what LEDs they use, how many, how they are setup in the blade,etc,etc would be greatly appreciated). I have a few ideas to make the MR style blades stand up to dueling-i.e. rolling over ideas in my head to strengthen the solder points as they are the defect not the LEDs.

Cain

***It is now that we battle.When you die, await my arrival in the afterlife where we will battle again.Perhaps there you may have the ability to defeat me,but not here,not now,not this day.So let us part with words and embrace the blade.***

LAN-ED-TUL
01-06-2006, 03:50 AM
all i know is MR's have 64 leds in a series. they light up in groups up and down the blade. i think like 5 or so at a time or something like that. i might be wrong. these other guys would know for sure, since i havent tore into my vader MR.

GeluKhanGharr
01-06-2006, 01:55 PM
Scaarmor, Lan-Ed is right, there are 64 LEDs in there, but they are connected in paralel. I believe there are 4 banks of 16 LEDs each and they get lit up one bank at the time. The diffusion is accomplished by the use of a foam sleve.

Born of Sith, seduced by the light.
http://www.saloncatalina.com/images/signature.jpg

LAN-ED-TUL
01-07-2006, 02:37 PM
ok, gelu, you can probably answer this question for me on this next saber project im working on. i asked it earlier but didnt really understand, or maybe i asked it wrong.

i will have a lux 3 red/orange led in Tims holder mounted in a heiland synchronar handle. i have made a switch box which sits on the outside of handle. it has the momentary switch to fire a 8 dollar sound board, and i want a green/constant and a red/blinking regular radio shack leds. can, or will it work, if i take the power lead that goes up to lux led, which also has the battery connected to the same wire, and wire them like this, power lead/+side of one led/-side out to other led + side/ out from - side back to main lead to lux? in other words, have the main power lead to lux led cut with the regluar leds connected between the cut?

i have a simple cad prg. but i cant get it to post. if i could, then i could show what i mean.

well i got paint to work, sorry for the not so neatness but i was trying to hurry.

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c291/LAN-ED-TUL/untitled.jpg


can i wire it this way, or will that draw too much current off the lux led? if it would work, then the regular leds should fire up at the same time as the sound/lux led all off the one momentary that fires the board/lux led.

GeluKhanGharr
01-09-2006, 01:33 PM
Lan-ed,

What you did there is serialize all LEDs. Doing it that way splits the voltage to each individual LED. Without getting into details of why, the Hasbro board would not supply enough voltage. One or more of the LEDs would not light up at all or light up very dimly. I'd say go with a parallel set-up like in my post from 12/14(page 1 of this thread). You don't need the resistors. Imagine the line that goes to the battery is the positive and the 2 lines going to the switch connect to the "negative lead to LED/LAMP" from the hasbro.
However, that set-up will still give you 3 LEDs that will be flashing when the Hasbro board sends out the flash. The only difference will be that your blinking LED will be blinking all the time. Like I said before - If I can figure out a way to draw constant power from the Hasbro(which is what you need for your 2 decoration LEDs) and still use the single momentary switch for the whole set-up, than I'd have a way to eliminate the flashing of the blade, but I still haven't found that solution yet.

Born of Sith, seduced by the light.
http://www.saloncatalina.com/images/signature.jpg

LAN-ED-TUL
01-11-2006, 10:23 AM
well, im not in any super rush to build it right now, just getting ideas on how i can accomplish it. i do have a couple of the parts prefabbed. like a holder for the sound board, ie.. but with the recent money i got, i am in the process of getting a rubies supreme vader costume. i have the fans, and the voice amp. i just won off ebay. just waitin for this last day for the auction to run down for the suit. if you remember the first lux i did was a vader/heiland saber? it will go great with the costume.

i remember you guys talking bout latching relays and such. i just wonder, if i used a relay, tapped into the momentary for the board, with the extra room i have, i could run another battery pack, i think, with ease, so it would run the deco leds off another battery pack, but still fire off from the single momentary, so everything fired up at the same time.

would that be possible gelu?

wood7588
01-11-2006, 04:02 PM
Hello All
I am new to the forum and have been having a similar problem with decorative hilt LEDs. I was hoping someone with more electronics experience might have the answers. I have 2 5mm LEDs that flash blue-red-green that I am mounting in the hilt. I got them off of ebay to save a buck but of course they did not come with any tech data. From a little bit of trial and error I found that they seem to run fine on 6-9 volts with a small resistor(I dont remember the ohms off hand but it is a 1/4 watt). I am running all the LEDS(luxeon 3W included) in Parallel off of 4 AA bateries(6V) using one switch. Here is my problem. When switched on the decorative LEDs dim out completely. The Luxeon seems to be responsible because when I disconnect it the 5mm LEDs return to normal. I have done some tinkering and found that 8 AA batteries(12V) will solve the problem but I dont have that much room in the hilt. Is there anything I can do to keep the power constant to the 5mm LEDs while useing 6V? I really like their look and it seems a shame not to use them.
Sorry to be so long winded but I was hoping that if I put out as much info on my set up as possible someone might recognize the error of my ways.
Thanks

LAN-ED-TUL
01-11-2006, 08:42 PM
thats kinda what gelu was getting at when he replied to my first question. thats when i thought of the before mentioned latching relays. i DO have enough room in my hilt, since its a 4 cell. and i am pretty sure i can run another battery pack to power the deco leds off of. problem is, i dont know if a latching relay hooked up to the momentary switch that fires up the hasbro sound board/lux led, will fire up both at the same time. thats what im waiting to see if gelu thinks i can go that way with it, somehow.

LAN-ED-TUL
01-25-2006, 02:08 AM
ok going off what was said bout latching relays i whipped up another crappy diagram. is this the right way to hook up a latching relay to the momentary switch that fires the hasbro/lux led? i have room for a seperate bat. pack to run the regular leds off of.


http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c291/LAN-ED-TUL/wirediag.jpg

i can get a relay off allelectronics in a spst n.o. type. i know pic is a bit small. but if i were to hook up the + and - wires to one end on the relay and then run the wires off the other end and hook + to one pole and - to other pole on the momentary switch would that then fire off the board and the relay together at the same time making the reg. leds and the lux/hasbro fire off together?

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...

LAN-ED-TUL
01-27-2006, 06:58 PM
gelu, or anyone else, i really could use an answer to this last possible connection question. if this will work, then i can order a latching relay from allelectronics and get started, with the exception of waiting for the regular led holders and the led, lens/holder from tim .

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...

hippie
02-03-2006, 11:53 PM
in all my experience with LEDs, ive been working with them for about 2 years, ive gotten to know that if you wire 2 or more LEDs in a row that you shouldnt use a resistor. the other LEDs will act as a resistor. you can use a resistor later if you want if you think that the LEDs are too bright

xwingband
02-04-2006, 09:34 AM
<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote">Originally posted by LAN-ED-TUL

gelu, or anyone else, i really could use an answer to this last possible connection question. if this will work, then i can order a latching relay from allelectronics and get started, with the exception of waiting for the regular led holders and the led, lens/holder from tim .

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...
<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">

I can honestly say it's too small to read. I can't tell what it what.

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www.dewbackwing.com</center>

LAN-ED-TUL
02-04-2006, 10:23 AM
i cant get it any bigger. photobucket resizes it. i can email it to you and attach it. then someone can open it with the picture viewer and its bigger then.

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...

xwingband
02-04-2006, 05:36 PM
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b394/reelbigporter/lux-wiring-with-relay.jpg

I linked it because it's actually too big. Even at 75% the text was screwy.[xx(] I turned it around pretty quick so I didn't even examine it...

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LAN-ED-TUL
02-05-2006, 04:32 AM
yeah, that link back to it shows up broken up and blurry. i cant win for losin i guess.

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...

LAN-ED-TUL
02-08-2006, 03:57 AM
it looks like the only way i can get 2 regular leds to fire off when i fire off the hasbro is to have 2 switches and hit both togetheror seperately. cuz i just cant seem to post a pic drawing so anyone can read it. oh well, guess my project wont be as sweet as it could of been.

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...

Do-Clo
02-08-2006, 08:42 AM
LAN-ED-TUL your drawing is fine but the problem lies in the lacthing relay with a reverse ploraity required to un latch it for powering off. I will give some thought to this problem and I will let you know if I come up with a solution.


Do-Clo
Don't make me destroy you...

LAN-ED-TUL
02-08-2006, 08:50 AM
thanx do-clo. like ya said, i dont know either, which polarity makes the connection for the board. hopefully you can find out.

im gonna look around for the speaker for that trik box. see what i can dig up.

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...

LAN-ED-TUL
02-17-2006, 10:58 PM
well i got the red led holder and adaptor today, and got the adaptor mounted and led lens/holder and the blade holder installed. now im waitin for the rest of my parts i ordered. the blade, tip,mirror, a batt. holder, and a thumbscrew. still tryin to figure out a way to fire the hasbro board/red lux led and the 2 regular leds off one switch. may just have to use a second switch, and run that circut seperately. would be nice tho to have it all come on together like i want. do-clo is still workin on this problem for me. hopefully he'll figure it out.

You dont know the POWER, of the dark side...

Ryma Mara
04-14-2007, 03:33 PM
Ok I got a question. the diagram is for when using a direct drive setup.

What about when using the MR board, how do you add smaller leds?

Do I do it like a direct drive is setup? on the power side from the battery pack after the switch I put in a resistor, then the led then a wire fromteh resistor to the negative side of the wire on the battery pack after the switch. well in teh way curent flows it would be before the switch wires.

Would that be right? and would radio shack have such resistor needed?

Novastar
04-18-2007, 12:02 PM
Ryma... for leds such as "on/off" indicators, and "nice to look at" leds?

If so, then yeah--sounds right. The resistor you need for the particular leds you'll use can be calculated with a simple resistor calculator...

http://www.ledcalc.com/

...and depend on the resistor used and the power provided.

From what you're saying, yes, you'll want to figure in the power "directly" if you're going straight from the batteries to the "pretty" low-level leds.

I have no idea what you'd do if you tried to go through the board FIRST and THEN thought about resisting the little LEDs.