Led Engin RGBAW Problem...

[C1p86]

I've a problem with a LED Engin LZ4 10W Multi Color:

Connected to a Petit Crouton Sound Module V2.0 it make not too much light (a little bit less than a Seul P4 connected to a Petit Crouton Sound Module V1.5).

I use Li-Ion 3,7V, 900mA.

I tried connecting directly battery to the led and it make a little bit more light, but not enought.

Just for explaining myself: if i put on the blade, it is not lighted till the end.

Any ideas?

Thanks!!!

[shmoetech]

do you have the leads wired correctly to led?

[Master Valon]

I could be wrong, but I don't think one 14500 cell is enough to power a 10W LED to full brightness. You would need at least a 2 cell, 7.4V pack, methinks. But, I'll let the other more experienced smiths here chime in.

[shmoetech]

Tim has data sheet lin at the shop for led.

[FenderBender]

If you're only running one cell, the PC absolutely can't run the LED and itself off of one cell. You need a 7.4V series pack for the PC to be able to drive the LEDengin (or run at all). Also, what dice are you using on the LEDengin? Just one die for one color? You do realize that each single die on a four die LED is only about as bright as a P4 or so right? You have to connect more of the dice together (different configs depending on color) to get the most out of the LED.

[C1p86]

Sorry, my fault. Of course I'm currently using TWO cells :-)
And the led is also wired correctly.

Could be a problem with the amperage of cells?

The problem is that if I'm not into a completely-dark room, the second half of the blade is not lighted at all...

[DarkarNights]

Also, what dice are you using on the LEDengin? Just one die for one color? You do realize that each single die on a four die LED is only about as bright as a P4 or so right? You have to connect more of the dice together (different configs depending on color) to get the most out of the LED.

Listen to Fender you should.

[Kevin Starwaster]

Does the blade have any diffuser film? Several layers of polypropylene will help.

However, also, ditto on listening to Fender. You're not going to get full power out of that LED module with only a few die wired. That's to be expected and unavoidable if you want to do color mixing.

Other factors to consider are: how much current did you configure the PC 2.0 to output to the LEDs? And are the LED dies wired in series or parallel? Parallel will split the current, so if you have two dies wired up, each one is only getting half of the current output.

So if you configured the PC to output 1 amp and two dies are wired, then each die is getting 0.5 amps. (500ma)

Edit: If you don't need to do color mixing then you should consider a different LED. If you only want to do red, green or blue for instance. Or white.

[C1p86]

Does the blade have any diffuser film? Several layers of polypropylene will help.

However, also, ditto on listening to Fender. You're not going to get full power out of that LED module with only a few die wired. That's to be expected and unavoidable if you want to do color mixing.

Other factors to consider are: how much current did you configure the PC 2.0 to output to the LEDs? And are the LED dies wired in series or parallel? Parallel will split the current, so if you have two dies wired up, each one is only getting half of the current output.

So if you configured the PC to output 1 amp and two dies are wired, then each die is getting 0.5 amps. (500ma)

Edit: If you don't need to do color mixing then you should consider a different LED. If you only want to do red, green or blue for instance. Or white.

No, I need color mixing!
Thanks, I missed the option for customizing the output Amps!

If I use two led (blue and green), have I to set to 1400amps? (700x2) ??

[Kevin Starwaster]

No, I need color mixing!
Thanks, I missed the option for customizing the output Amps!

If I use two led (blue and green), have I to set to 1400amps? (700x2) ??

That's correct, except that you mean 1400 milliamps which is 1.4 amps. And yes, if you're wired in parallel then you're splitting the current so that each die is getting 0.7 amps. The PC 2.0 can output 2 amps which would give each die 1 amp, which they are capable of handling.

[DarkarNights]

Make sure to check the specs for the LEDs if you decide to try different combos, for example Red won't handle the same current as Blue and Green.

[Kevin Starwaster]

Make sure to check the specs for the LEDs if you decide to try different combos, for example Red won't handle the same current as Blue and Green.

Are you perhaps thinking about voltage? That's the only thing that changes. Current is the same.

[DarkarNights]

Ah, so the red die on an LEDEngin doesn't have the same mA limitations as a single Red Luxeon which should max at 700mA?

[Kevin Starwaster]

Ah, so the red die on an LEDEngin doesn't have the same mA limitations as a single Red Luxeon which should max at 700mA?

No, and they're supposed to be able to go even higher than the 1A that I stated, but then you're shortening their lifespan. Then again, how many hours a year does your saber is your saber actually active? So is the shortened lifespan significant? I dunno, but they measure the lifespan in tens of thousands of hours I think... I forget exactly and ima too tired to look it up.

[C1p86]

I'm trying this configuration:

7349

(the current of green and blue leds is controlled by the petit crouton and there is no a real resistor)
But for the red and white leds i have to put a resistor in order to make them work at 1A.
But, if each led use 2,5W, can I use a normal resistor or I need a white-ceramic resistor that support 5W?

What problem could I have?

Thanks very much to everyone!

-----------------------------------------
P.S.: i'm using:
a Petit crouton 2.0
two cells 3.7V, 900mAh, max discard rate 1.5C
and the LED Engin RGBW (10W)

so, if exist a better way please, tell me! :D

[Kevin Starwaster]

I'm trying this configuration:

7349

(the current of green and blue leds is controlled by the petit crouton and there is no a real resistor)
But for the red and white leds i have to put a resistor in order to make them work at 1A.
But, if each led use 2,5W, can I use a normal resistor or I need a white-ceramic resistor that support 5W?

What problem could I have?

Thanks very much to everyone!

-----------------------------------------
P.S.: i'm using:
a Petit crouton 2.0
two cells 3.7V, 900mAh, max discard rate 1.5C
and the LED Engin RGBW (10W)

so, if exist a better way please, tell me! :D

First, request for clarified circuit showing exactly what you're doing because I'm a little confused by what you're trying to convey with that diagram except that it seems to indicate that blue and green are wired in series to each other, red and white are wired in series with each other. And the diagram also indicates that both sets of LED dies are then wired in parallel on the same power source. Going strictly by the diagram I don't see a problem, but that's not really what you're doing here is it?

Previously you indicated that the only dies on the LedEngin that were being driven by the PC are the blue and green. If the blue and green are wired in parallel to each other then you can configure the PC for its full 2 amps because blue and green will split the current so that each gets 1 amp. Parallel means that each dies negative pad is wired to the PC's negative LED pad and each dies positive pad is wired to the PCs positive pad. (this is how I interpreted what you said before and why I said you could set the PC for 2A)

Edit: Removed section about wiring in series as Fender indicates the combined voltage is higher than what can be provided.

[DarkarNights]

You need to make clear exactly what your goal here is, because I can't figure out why you are trying to wire all 4 dies that way?

[FenderBender]

Do NOT wire blue and green in series. Together they will want like 8v or more and the battery pack can't support that. This configuration (or any combination of two cool colors) is best run in parallel and set at two amps on the PC to give each die 1A. For the red and white in series (which is fine for Flash on Clash) a 2W 1Ohm metal film resistor is fine, no need for the ceramic resistors.

[Kevin Starwaster]

Do NOT wire blue and green in series. Together they will want like 8v or more and the battery pack can't support that. This configuration (or any combination of two cool colors) is best run in parallel and set at two amps on the PC to give each die 1A. For the red and white in series (which is fine for Flash on Clash) a 2W 1Ohm metal film resistor is fine, no need for the ceramic resistors.

Sorry, didn't think about what the combined blue/green voltage was adding up to.

[C1p86]

But these cells have 1.5C as maximum discharge rate, so i cannot ask more then 1350mA at once.

Right?


Do NOT wire blue and green in series. Together they will want like 8v or more and the battery pack can't support that. This configuration (or any combination of two cool colors) is best run in parallel and set at two amps on the PC to give each die 1A. For the red and white in series (which is fine for Flash on Clash) a 2W 1Ohm metal film resistor is fine, no need for the ceramic resistors.

8v? I read this from specs:

R -> 2,2V
W -> 3,2V
B -> 3,2V
G -> 3,35V

So i wired: BG -> 6,55 and WR -> 5,4

I have 7,4 from cells and it should be ok, with appropriate resistor (2 - 3 OHM)...
Something wrong?

[DarkarNights]

I'm still not sure what your ultimate goal is. Are you intending to use R and W with a PEX for Flash on Clash? And it seems like you are still dead set on wiring B and G in series for your main blade from the PC even though two members have told you that's a bad idea. I highly recommend listening to Fender, he knows what he is talking about.

[C1p86]

I'm still not sure what your ultimate goal is. Are you intending to use R and W with a PEX for Flash on Clash? And it seems like you are still dead set on wiring B and G in series for your main blade from the PC even though two members have told you that's a bad idea. I highly recommend listening to Fender, he knows what he is talking about.

My fault. I Read that

http://forums.thecustomsabershop.com/showthread.php?13703-LEDengin-5w-and-10W-info-and-wiring-guide....for-noobs

and I missunderrstood Fender advice :-) (hurry is a bad thing)
I thought that he suggested to connect them in series, and I cannot understand why now he was telling me not to do that...

Ok, now I got it.
Just to know: what is the problem in linking LEDs in series?

Takes a lot!

[Kevin Starwaster]

My fault. I Read that

http://forums.thecustomsabershop.com/showthread.php?13703-LEDengin-5w-and-10W-info-and-wiring-guide....for-noobs

and I missunderrstood Fender advice :-) (hurry is a bad thing)
I thought that he suggested to connect them in series, and I cannot understand why now he was telling me not to do that...

Ok, now I got it.
Just to know: what is the problem in linking LEDs in series?

Takes a lot!

I was a little confused about that myself so I went back to the spec sheets. The MAXIMUM voltage rating for the blue and green dice are 4.2 and 4.0 respectively. I was thinking those were only upper limits, but if the PC actually pushes that much out to them then it's not going to be able to as long as they are wired in series. Can you do it anyway? Will it *work*? Yeah, I'm pretty sure it will. But they're not running at full power, and that's what prompted you to start this thread right? Not bright enough?

I'd like to hear from Fender myself as I hate to speak as to what other people are thinking, but I think that's what he's thinking here. I'd go with his recommendation and go with blue and green in parallel.